John Betts

Ryburgh Remembers

Pte. 235768 John Betts

8th.Btn. York and Lancaster Regiment

March 1882 - October 12th. 1917

John Betts photographed whilst with the Norfolk Yeomanry. He was transferred to the Yorks and Lancs Regiment in the field about one month before he was killed.

 

 

John Betts’ Service Record survived destruction after the collected records were blitzed in WW2. However, it was badly damaged and quite a lot of it is no longer decipherable. From what survives we learn that he signed his Imperial and Service Obligation form in Norwich on 23rd November 1915. He signed up for 4 years at the age of 33 years and 8 months. His listed occupation was given as Farm Labourer. As an 18 year old, he was lodging with Testerton Farm Bailiff, William Keeley in the hall cottages and working as Under Agg Horse Man on Farm.

He was 5 feet 31/2 inches tall and weighed 8 Stone. It is noted:

 ”Dentures necessary for efficient mastication” a “slight defect but not sufficient to cause rejection”

His Army career is anotated thus:

7th Yeomanry Cyclist Regt. Right Wing 02 /11/1916

 

Kings Own Royal Regt. Norfolk Yeomanry 18 /04/1917

 

Embarked Folkestone 02 /09/1917

 

Disembarked Boulogne ditto

 

Arrived (M 17 I B D?) 04/09/1917

 

Posted to 1/4th Btn Suffolk Regt.

 

Transferred to Yorks. & Lancs. Corps

 

Posted 8th. Btn. Yorks. &Lancs. 11/09/1917

 

Killed in Action 12/10/1917

 

The Yorks. and Lancs. War diary that we have been able to read ends on 30th October and gives no resume´of casualties for the month of October. The entry for the 9th to 12th October says the following:

 

Oct. 9th. 3.30p.m. Battalion moved from Metteren in lorries to RIDGE WOOD CAMP where they spent the night in bivouacs.

Oct. 10th 2.30 p.m. Battalion moved up to the trenches in front of POLYGON WOOD, & relieved the 2nd Warwicks in the 7th Division after their attack in front of the wood. Relief not complete till the following night.

Oct 11th Situation normal. Enemy Snipers very active.

Oct 12th Situation normal. One of our aeroplanes brought down by hostile Anti-Aircraft-Guns: just in rear of our front line. Pilot & Observer reached our front line safely.

 

The following day they were relieved by the 9th Yorkshires.

 

It can only be assumed that he unluckily fell victim to German sniper fire whilst briefly at the front line.

 

When his Army form W 5080 was completed in August 1918 his living family were given as:

 

Parents:

William Betts 1850- 1934 and Fanny Frost 1854-1945 pictured in their garden with the Maltings behind.

The Betts family lived in the house next to the bakery. This picture of the widowed Fanny taken outside the family home before her move to Binham where she died in 1945. Her funeral took place at St Andrew’s:

 

Brothers:

Robert ….age 39 living in Leytonstone Essex

George… age 37 “ Colk(irk) Fakenham

Arthur …. age 30 “ New Cross Kent:

Arthur Betts

 

Ernest … age 28 “ Fakenham

Fred…….age 20 “ On Active Service

Sister Mary …...age 24 “ Great Ryburgh.

Mary Betts and her sister-in-law Margery (Mrs Arthur Betts)

 

Mary Betts with her husband William(Bill) Thurlow at Row Hill Farm, Hindringham during WW2. pictured with 2 German P.O.W’s from the camp at Fakenham (Pudding Norton) Their names were Joe Freischhei from Bonn and Bernhard Rosendahl from Goslar.  

 

This list doesn’t include Edmund Walter born in 1886, the eighth of William and Fanny’s children who was killed six weeks later serving with the Royal Welsh Fusiliers.

Medals were dispatched to his father Dec 1922 (note in service record says that no receipt has been received.) It is village hearsay that his mother returned them to the Army with the comment that her sons had not given their lives but they had been taken from her. This may have been in part a response to comments intended to be comforting like this from Revd. F.H.Tatham in the Parish magazine where he wrote in January 1918 regarding brother Walter : Our very deepest sympathy to the relatives of Walter Betts. Who has laid down his life for his country, the second in this family and in so short a time”. Walter’s name never joined his brother’s on the Think and Thank Screen in St Thomas’ Chapel although he is to be found on the village memorial.

 

 

 

 

 

John Betts is commemorated on Stone 126 of the Tyne Cot Memorial which would indicate that his body was never recovered for burial.

 

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Although the Roll of Honour doesn’t contain Edmund Walter’s name, it does include those of his two brothers, Ernest and Fred 

 

Of Ernest we have the following information at this stage:

He was born on April 30th. 1891 and enlisted with the Norfolk Regiment as Pte. 19734 Ernest Henry Betts. He first saw Active Service in France on December 22nd 1915 and was discharged the Army on May 21st. 1917. This was on account of a G.un S.hot W.ound to his right arm. In addition  to his 1915 Star, British War and Victory medals he also received the Silver War Badge upon discharge. He married Margaret Jane Cubitt of Colkirk in the last quarter of 1917 and lived in Lichfield Street Fakenham.  Margaret died in 1975 but no confirmed date has been found the death of Ernest himself.

 

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Of Frederick Betts, who it was noted on Army Form W 5080 was on Active Service, we have the following information found mainly in his surviving Service Record:


Born 13th September 1897

Admitted to Ryburgh School on 6th. October 1902

School Log book for 10th Oct reads “Have admitted several fresh children”

He left school 20th August 1910 to be a “farm hand”

He enlisted on 10 Dec 1915 aged 18 yrs 3 months initially with Norfolk Yeomanry  

(Regt No 3125) at the Norwich Cattle Market

Transferred to Royal Engineers Reserve Household Btn. No 1886

5’3” tall and weighed 116 lbs

Before enlisting he had been a porter on the GER. working at Lakenheath

Mobilised 9th September 1916

 

Embarked Southampton 3/2/1917

Disembarked LeHavre 4/2/17

Medical Board classified as T.M.B (Flat Feet) Dec 28th 1917

Had weak ankles form infancy, further aggravated by Military Service

Transferred to England 2/12/1917

then various transfers to :

RE Rly Construction Troops Longmoor 26/1/18 with rank of Pioneer

trade: “shed labourer”

Posted Rly Construction Troops Longmoor 22/2/18

Transportation Stores Coy , Purfleet 26/3/18

Allotted new Regtl No WR/200189 15/6/18

Appointed Acting Cpl 2/12/18

Remustered Sapper, with the trade of Fireman 30/1/19

Transferred to the Z Reserve 7 Nov 1919

Spent 3 years and 60 days in war service (10 months in France)

 

It is not known if Fred continued to work on the Railway after he was demobbed, but it is known that he sadly died in WW2 as the result of a direct hit on the coffee shop on Yarmouth Vauxhall Station. The following inscription is to be found on the WW2 Memorial in St George’s Park Great Yarmouth


BETTS Frederick Civilian war dead:

Died 7 May 1943, Aged 45, Husband of D. M. Betts of 24 Brooke Avenue, Caister-on-Sea.

Died on Vauxhall Station.

 

 

We are very grateful to Keith Venables, John Betts'  Great Nephew  for sharing information about, and the wonderful images of this Ryburgh family above.

 

copyright 2017


Those who served
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Webpage icon Edmund Walter Betts
Webpage icon Charles Thomas Steward
Webpage icon Frederick John Bone
Webpage icon Herbert Albert Chastney
Webpage icon Albert Green
Webpage icon Frederick Green
Webpage icon Joseph Chad Howman
Webpage icon Everard Barnard Hubart Hipkin
Webpage icon Harold Douglas Palmer Comer
Webpage icon Frederick William Baldwin
Webpage icon Harry Victor Chilvers
Webpage icon Percy Henry Neale
Webpage icon Stanley Curson
Webpage icon Richard Reginald Platten
Webpage icon Robert William Barker
Webpage icon Cecil Stephen Kail
Webpage icon Herbert Walton Fox
Webpage icon Walter Francis Fenn
Webpage icon George Harry Bond
Webpage icon Ernest William Thompson
Webpage icon John William "Charles" Cremer.
Page last updated: Saturday September 30th 2017 11:41 PM